Dow falls below 10k

RUN FOR THE HILLS! Despite sinking 700Billion, we're still doomed!

 

Looks like we should have just let it play out, because it's going to anyways!

The actual effects of that bill probably won't take effect until a few weeks down the road. Don't go investing in the "under your mattress" bank yet.

From what I heard they wouldn't see significant impact until 2010...

seriously 800+ billion could have accomplished so much, instead we pissed it down the drain.

So much for the argument that National Healthcare is too big of a check to write, eh?

national healthcare is BS, and would just be another welfare, AKA a huge effing failure.

 

We should not have done the bailout. this is a Capitalist country and we should have let capitalism work as it would have.

 

Instead we just gave the same people that got us into this mess 800b, with no stipulations for them to hand out as they see fit....what a waste.

Too bad the Fair tax would never get put into play. Too many corrupt/greedy congressmen and lobbyists that would be out of a job.

Too bad the Fair tax would never get put into play. Too many corrupt/greedy congressmen and lobbyists that would be out of a job.

Srsly, Even my liberal ass can get behind the fair tax.

 

Income tax is so @#$%ing stupid.

/fairtax

 

I dont know why it's not something more people make a fuss about. It just seems fair. Tax everyone 20% of what they make or w/e and be done with it.

The beauty of the fair tax is that you pay 0% income tax, that's for everyone! Instead there is a 22-23% flat tax on purchases. No income tax for businesses either which makes it VERY attractive for plants and HQs to be built in America. Think about it, if you don't spend money you can save as much as you want 100% of your money. But if you buy luxury items, you pay for it. If you are a low income house, the government sends you a check monthly for likr $585 which covers the flat tax you'd buy on necessities. An interview with 500 CEOs in Japan said that if this happened tomorrow in the USA, 80% would build their next factory in the US, and the other 20% would move their HQ here. Imagine the economic boom, and new jobs that would create for us.

 

The only reason we won't see this is because it would eliminate over 80% of lobbyists (they would have no corporate taxes to lobby over,) and politicians would have no bargaining chips to get favors if there were no taxes to lower for big business. And let's not forget the IRS would not exist anymore

 

Fair tax is a solution, but will never happen. If that doesn't piss you off I don't know what will xD

Tax everyone 20% of what they make or w/e and be done with it.

That isn't what the fair tax is at all o_O

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairtax

http://www.amazon.com/Fair-Tax-Book-Saying...9440&sr=8-2

 

The only reason we won't see this is because it would eliminate over 80% of lobbyists (they would have no corporate taxes to lobby over,) and politicians would have no bargaining chips to get favors if there were no taxes to lower for big business. And let's not forget the IRS would not exist anymore

Not to mention that money=power, and taking your money from your paycheck was the biggest gift of power the US Government ever gave itself. It has no interest in losing that power.

Edited October 6, 2008 by Hykos

Too many corrupt/greedy congressmen and lobbyists that would be out of a job.

 

But...but Shad.

 

"Greed, for all intents and purposes, is good." -Gordon Gekko

Hahahaha I love that movie XD

Well it should be BW!

OMFG! IT DIDN'T WORK IMMEDIATELY!!! WUTRWEGUNNADOOOO?!?

 

I think what happened today is a product of foreign credit markets as much as ours. And I guess they should get to finish writing up the actual plan before it can start working.

Edited October 6, 2008 by Daghostmaker

I'm too poor to care....but, here in Canada we have a tax thats kinda like the "fairtax" your describing. Essentially provinces and the federal government tax like 15%(about that, not exactly) of all you purchases. Its on everything, except things like "wholesome" food(junk/fast food is still taxed). But on top of that we still have a pretty hefty income tax. It pays for our health care and shit so I guess its ok, but its not a cure all.

 

Wouldn't it just make more sense to actually tax the rich, and eliminate the tax loopholes they have? I mean if you make over a million dollars a year wouldn't a 50% income tax be ok? I'm pretty sure if countries like Canada and the US did something like that we would all be much better off.

I'm too poor to care....but, here in Canada we have a tax thats kinda like the "fairtax" your describing. Essentially provinces and the federal government tax like 15%(about that, not exactly) of all you purchases. Its on everything, except things like "wholesome" food(junk/fast food is still taxed). But on top of that we still have a pretty hefty income tax. It pays for our health care and shit so I guess its ok, but its not a cure all.

 

Wouldn't it just make more sense to actually tax the rich, and eliminate the tax loopholes they have? I mean if you make over a million dollars a year wouldn't a 50% income tax be ok? I'm pretty sure if countries like Canada and the US did something like that we would all be much better off.

 

And how exactly is a tax like that fair? Why should one person pay a larger percent than another person?

Wouldn't it just make more sense to actually tax the rich, and eliminate the tax loopholes they have? I mean if you make over a million dollars a year wouldn't a 50% income tax be ok? I'm pretty sure if countries like Canada and the US did something like that we would all be much better off.

 

srsly. how the hell is that fair? Why should someone be penalized for being productive?

 

What a great reward for hard work, education, and intelligence. We take your money and give it to other people!

I agree with the ultra rich paying their share but 50% is insanity. If it takes hitting people making $40 million a year with a slightly higher rate than someone making $12000 to keep the majority prospering, then so be it but it shouldn't be unnecessarily laborious. I don't support a huge redistribution of wealth but when the deck is stacked so egregiously against the less fortunate, something needs to be done to level the playing field. Hard work, education and intelligence are no more exclusive to the rich than the opportunities that they are given to acquire and showcase them.

 

But companies bitching about 'the 2nd highest corporate tax rate in the world' doesn't really hold water when most of them slide through loopholes in the system that makes it more like the 2nd lowest tax rate in the world.

The beauty of the fair tax is that you pay 0% income tax, that's for everyone! Instead there is a 22-23% flat tax on purchases. No income tax for businesses either which makes it VERY attractive for plants and HQs to be built in America. Think about it, if you don't spend money you can save as much as you want 100% of your money. But if you buy luxury items, you pay for it. If you are a low income house, the government sends you a check monthly for likr $585 which covers the flat tax you'd buy on necessities. An interview with 500 CEOs in Japan said that if this happened tomorrow in the USA, 80% would build their next factory in the US, and the other 20% would move their HQ here. Imagine the economic boom, and new jobs that would create for us.

 

The only reason we won't see this is because it would eliminate over 80% of lobbyists (they would have no corporate taxes to lobby over,) and politicians would have no bargaining chips to get favors if there were no taxes to lower for big business. And let's not forget the IRS would not exist anymore

 

Fair tax is a solution, but will never happen. If that doesn't piss you off I don't know what will xD

If businesses had to pay 22% on their purchases (i.e. the raw materials they process, or wholesale goods they resell), I don't think most would be doing any better than they are now. "Our people are our product" companies would be happy I suppose.

 

But to take a simple example, if a corner store buys a bag of chips for $1 and sells it for $1.25, they make $0.25 profit on the whole transaction. They would pay, I don't know, 25% tax on that profit, or 6 cents, for an after-tax profit of ~19 cents.

 

If they had to pay 22% on their wholesale purchase, they end up making only 3 cents... Or they have to mark their chips up and pass the tax on to the consumers to give them a chance at making a decent profit.

 

Would stock purchases be taxed the same 22%? (i.e. a 22% front-end load?) That would hurt... It would certainly force a long-term investment strategy I guess! (All traders would be forced out of work, not sure if that is a good or bad thing!)

back to the op . . . time to sink more money into your 401k . . . buy low sell when you retire. you're bound to make a lot of money. if the economy fails you won't need money anyways amiright?

If businesses had to pay 22% on their purchases (i.e. the raw materials they process, or wholesale goods they resell), I don't think most would be doing any better than they are now. "Our people are our product" companies would be happy I suppose.

 

But to take a simple example, if a corner store buys a bag of chips for $1 and sells it for $1.25, they make $0.25 profit on the whole transaction. They would pay, I don't know, 25% tax on that profit, or 6 cents, for an after-tax profit of ~19 cents.

 

If they had to pay 22% on their wholesale purchase, they end up making only 3 cents... Or they have to mark their chips up and pass the tax on to the consumers to give them a chance at making a decent profit.

 

Would stock purchases be taxed the same 22%? (i.e. a 22% front-end load?) That would hurt... It would certainly force a long-term investment strategy I guess! (All traders would be forced out of work, not sure if that is a good or bad thing!)

 

Prices after tax would go up but the baseline price would be the same (remember you have ALL your money not just what you would have now after income tax.) Look at your to date pay stub and see how much has come out, imagine having all money for you, and paying the additional $.29 for chips. And on top of that, the business isn't paying tax on the profit they made for the day. The weight of taxes was paid solely by the consumer.

 

Here is a kicker as well: You buy a new car, you pay the fair tax on it. You sell it 8 years later. Because it is a used car, you can sell it tax free.

More importantly ours is a consumption based economy so it makes more sense to tax the consumtion then it is to tax the earnings. You're not going where the money is and trying to make an overly complicated system to try and get to it.

 

This is the way to equalize the tax burden.

Completely agree. And you can never get busted for tax evasion! Unless they steal a car or buy one that is stolen, even drug dealers would get taxed!

Completely agree. And you can never get busted for tax evasion! Unless they steal a car or buy one that is stolen, even drug dealers would get taxed!

I know!!!

 

/fair tax party!